Then you start it up.  The faces fall.  "Wazzat, an electric motor?"  Maybe they didn't say it, but they probably thought it. 

We've gotta fix that.  It's gotta sound like it looks.  And more power.  What's the point if your pipes rob power?  But you don't want a headache on the slab.  And you sure don't want pipes on your otherwise beautiful machine. 

This calls for Cherry Bombs, like you put on your Chevy hotrod 30 years ago.  Great, deep sound.  But not huge volume.  A promise of the power, the loping of the cam while she idles.  Goose it. 

GRRROOOWWWLLLLblub blub blub. 

WOW, man, that's what she's SUPPOSED to sound like!!
 

Wait a minute.  At the Sonic Drive In.  Harleys abound.  Talk about PIPES! Man.  Glasspacks ain't enough.   Sometimes only straight pipes will do.
 

Time for MarkT's Mild2WILD™ TromboneTM Glasspacks! Instantly convertible glasspacks to straight pipes, with the ONLY double-wall aftermarket headers available for the Valkyrie ¹.  Tune the sound you want with the slides in, infinitely tunable for all sound levels and timbre between packs and straight pipes.  Swap between your custom straight pipe sound and glasspacks without tools in seconds.

So now you reach into your bag of tricks and pull out your TromBones™.  Slip them in the ends of the pipes, no tools, 10 seconds per. Start 'er up.

ROOOAAARRRRRR!!!
 

HOLY SMOKES, WHAT IZZAT?????

Let's go Harley hunting!

OOPS.

Mama wants it quiet on the road.  But you wanna ROAR when ya get there.  What to do?

Slip in the Silencers for the trip.
B4 ya get there yank em out for your Grand Arrival and you're
Mellow Rumblin.

To show the Hardleys what a REAL engine sounds like,

slip in the Bones_tm and she ROARS!!!

And ALL these sounds without rejetting, and with 6-11 more ponies than stock!!!!!!!!!!²

                                                              FIVE inch
         Dean's M2W pipes with 4"X 38" Howitzers    JJ's M2W pipes with 4" X 36" Blades      Tim's M2W pipes with 5" X 38" Blades

                          Sid's M2W pipes with 4"X 40" Howitzers         Ross's M2W pipes with 4"X 36" Bugles         Rodney's M2W pipes with 4" X 38" Blades

                           Eric's M2W pipes with 4"X 40" Howitzers        SteveL's M2W pipes with 4"X 34" Blades              Saiid's 4" X 41" Howitzers

                            Bob's M2W pipes with 4" X 36" Blades      Rick's M2W pipes with 4" X 36" Howitzers   Condor's M2W pipes with 4" X 38" Howitzers

                                              Bamajack bought 3 sets of pipes - all M2W with 4" X 36" Blades (miter down)  Here's the first two.

So how do MarkT's Mild2WILD _tm Trombone_tm Glasspacks work?

Glasspacks have an inner tube that is perforated, and an outer tube.  A roll of glasspack blanket is packed in between.  The glasspack muffles sound by allowing the exhaust pulses to be absorbed through the perforations by the glass blanket.   TromBones_tm work by blocking those holes and passing from some to all of the pulses, unabsorbed out the end of the pipe.  YOU control the sound level by how many of the holes are blocked. I.O.W., The TromBones_tm  effectively allow you to change the length of your glasspacks from zero to eighteen inches.  And they have no effect on the tune! - See Joe Norris' dyno run with & without Bones.

Mild2WILD _tm TromBonesTM are delivered full length, if you leave them that way you will have straight pipes when you insert them.  The outlet end is of sufficient length to reach almost to the end of the stock tips, and equipped with a locator pin and a steel latch.    There is a matching slot and hole in the glasspack outlet.  This allows you to insert and remove the Trombone_tm slides by feel and without tools.   Remember to use adequate gloves if the exhaust is hot. 

 
To adjust the volume you want when the Trombone_tm slides are inserted, you move the slides in and out so they are the same as each other, and rev the engine, until you have the sound you're looking for. 
 

Then measure the amount the locator pin is out of the bottom of the slot, pull the Trombone_tm slides out, and cut off that same amount from the insert end of the slide with a hacksaw. VOILA!  You have tuned the volume to YOUR taste!

The Silencers.     
I was looking for a way to make this puppy quieter for yo' mama.    What if you chop off the back few inches of the stock muffler, where the back baffles are, and fit it into the end of the stacks?  There's already a glasspack in front, all ya have to do is block some of the sound waves without impeding flow. Since all three tubes in the silencer now vent every exhaust pulse, the flow through the Silencer has ONE THIRD the backpressure it had in it's original use.  The exhaust system will REMAIN A PERFORMANCE EXHAUST thanks to the collector at the header end!!!

ZOWIE!!!!

It works!!!!  And there's no loss of power.  On the dyno, no difference between silencer in or out.  And almost as quiet as stock, yet with still a nice rumbly note!!!!!

Here's some pics of the Silencers_tm:

Notice I have 40"  stacks.  I LIKE them.  But then I like big pipes.  Most folks are going for 36" stacks.

A bit more on Silencers_tm compatibility issues  etc:

To get the Silencers_tm , you have to order at least 32" Howitzer stacks, or 36" Blade stacks for them to fit.   The Silencers_tm are pinned in place with a screw through one of the tip mount holes - I used the tip mount nut on the piggy but there's no reason it couldn't be one of the other two on the can if you've whacked off your piggies.   I chuck the rear section of your stock muffler in my lathe and remove the sidewalls.    Sand them smooth,  and test fit them.   The stacks are not truly round, and neither are the stock mufflers.  So I use two custom presses I made to shape them - a press that expands from the inside of the stack and another that compresses the outside of the Silencers_tm until they are compatible.    If you have done the Ragnar cut, you've destroyed your Silencers_tm - I usually have some cores on hand to make them from.  If you've drilled the baffles - I will need to plug them with the same plugs Honda uses to get the full muffling effect.   The price of the Silencers _tm  includes gasketing around the glasspack at the back edge of the internal can, so the silencer doesn't cause exhaust to move forward past the glasspack and out the clamp access windows.

Can you get Silencers_tm if you already have Packs & Stacks?  Yes, contingent upon successfully sourcing cores to get the Silencers_tm from.  Cost will be $60 for my labor, plus the cores, and shipping. 

The _tm  

I was asked why didn't I develop a crossover option for the M2W_tm system?  Well why not indeed.  I had some time and several guys were asking for it.  Everyone knows a crossover properly configured on a dual-exhaust system will enhance and smooth torque, and make more power.  I didn't know it also mellows the sound out.  Makes kind of a bigger-room, echo sort of effect.  Like it has more depth.  How cool!

OK so I did it.  I've delivered quite a few Crossfire_tm systems now, and feedback is coming in.  I received a dyno chart but it has a discrepancy so I think the best thing is for me to dyno my own bike once I get this system installed, that way I can document all the pertinent variables.  Mike says he picked up 11 ponies with his Crossfire _tm system, and about 10 ft-lbs of peak torque, compared to his stock exhaust.  His bike benefitted quite a bit from a better-breathing exhaust - looks like we nailed his bike's weak point pretty well.  Now of course we can't guarantee your bike will respond the same - just too many variables involved.  But a better breathing exhaust with scavenging and a crossover is one of the most cost-effective ways to get more punch out of your Valk.

As for me - well I plan to get this CrossFire_tm system set up on my bike - I'll have to start over with another set of cores and fit it in between customer orders.   I've been surprised there has been so much interest considering I put this on my web page after they quit making the Valkyrie - I mentioned it once and holy cow apparently there's a lot of hot rodders out there who want the different sounds of my system as well as good power.  Well you know what they say - the cobbler's kids go barefoot.

Well here's some pics of the system.  It involves significant changes to my design, to still support customer replacement of the glasspacks in case you're concerned about that .  Which by the way you won't be doing anytime soon - I ran my original glasspack on the left side, about 60,000 miles after I first installed it - and it sounded the same as the right side which I replaced about 40,000 miles later due to a wreck.   I sold that original used set to a buyer who wanted to save money - I told him all about it, when he got it he didn't say he could hear any difference either.  And after making over 800 sets since '98 I have never been asked to sell replacement glasspacks except to guys who want to buy them up front in case I get hit by a truck.  Hope they don't know something I don't.

To support easy glasspack replacement, I made the glasspack inlet a snug fit on the header collector.  Then I put a hole in the inlet sidewall, positioned the pack and welded through the hole.  Then I put a dimple on the weld to guide a drill bit.  And lastly, after the can is assembled and welded in place, I weld the muffler can directly to the glasspack at the rear mount bracket, where I removed one of the original spot welds holding the baffles in. To replace the glasspack you reach inside at the access window with a 1/2" drill and drill out the weld.  Then grind off the weld next to the rear bracket.  Then the glasspack is removable from the outlet (a slide hammer with a hook into the trombone latch pops it loose if it's balky).  Put another hole in the glasspack inlet, stick it back on the collector and tack-weld at the hole through the access window and again at the rear bracket.  OK, it's a little harder than the  non-CrossFire_tm version but much easier than cutting the system apart, should you ever want to change glasspacks.

Here's what the whole system looks like.  Notice I used stainless flex tube to make it easy to install.  Also it allows you to have some flexibility in case you need to route around something under your swingarm, like a big horn.  You get a couple inches of deflection.  Be sure to tell me if you need this so I can add a little extra length to the the flex tube.

I don't recommend TromBones_tm with CrossFire_tm and stock covers as the Bones will protrude.  Though you wouldn't have that problem with aftermarket tips that are 2" or more longer than the Tourer / Standard stock tips.

Cost of the CrossFire_tm option - well I'm trying to keep it down, but it still is adding over a half day to the build time.   So I'm limiting the extra cost to $120 for now and I'm thinking the build time will agree with that after a few more copies.

Now back to the rest of the Mild2WILD_tm Trombone_tm Silencer  Glasspacks story:

Top quality materials are used in MarkT's Mild2WILD _tm Trombonetm  Glasspacks.  I begin with the stock Honda 6-6 exhaust, with all stainless internals and double wall chromed headers (still the ONLY double wall - won't - headers for the Valkyrie ¹).  Honda is known for the quality of their chrome.  Then after disassembling the muffler can, I weld in a heavy gauge custom header collector.   Now we have changed the configuration from a baffled 6-6 exhaust to a 6-2 performance exhaust, which will provide 5% or more increase in power without rejetting!² See Michael Hart & friends, comparative dyno runs - (his page displayed from this domain, with permission) glasspacks come out on top!

But what about the claim that equal length headers produce the most power?  They do, for a narrow rpm band.  Better for racing, if you keep the rpm's in that range.  Do you race your bike?  Different-length headers are more "streetable", with the torque optimized across the rpm band, for more low-end torque.  The shortest header is optimized for higher rpm's, while the longer is better for lower rpms. 

How about  "increased tube diameter increases the velocity for max power"?  The last part is true - more velocity in the exhaust stream IS better for torque.  The Honda engineers are among the best in the world - we all benefit from their smarts, and they designed the headers for the Valk.  But you don't get more velocity in a stream by INCREASING the cross section.  That slows it down.  Our pipes utilize the Honda-engineered correct-diameter headers with higher velocity exhaust for more torque.    

Two windows are cut in the back of the can for access to a heavy duty muffler clamp, which protrudes out the back of the can - making it easy for you to change glasspacks if you keep the bike forever.   

But now it's time to build the TromBonestm !  They are fitted to be interchangeable left and right.  These tubes are aluminized steel so they stay pretty.  The release lever is easily reachable in the end of the pipe, just lift and pull and your bike is civilized again! 

Audio Files

So what do they sound like?  Well, hearing it in person is of course much better than WAV files, but here's a couple to whet your appetite:

Mike Slavis made some really cool .WMV (Windows Media Video) files, playing the pipes before the mod, with glasspacks, Bones half way in, and all the way in.  You can download the player from microsoft free, here .  Good sound, it's worth it.  Thanks Mike.  Nice job.  Here's the files:

Stock pipes.    Glasspacks.   Packs & uncut Bones.   Packs & Half Bones.

See also, Brian's MPG video of his FIVE inch stacks, below. If you prefer, give me a call, I'll fire Deerslayer up for you, and you can hear it live over the phone.    Call 720-851-8455 or toll free 877-338-1077

FIVE inch stacks

 

Brian Kane sent me a video of his beautiful pearl white standard with five inch Howitzers, and TromBones installed.  Good audio, nicely photographed.  Great job Brian, thanks!

Brian Kane's video of 5" Howitzers with Bones installed, 4.0MB mpg, broadband recommended, opens in new window

HERE's a custom exhaust:  five inch stacks when everybody else is running fours.  Here's Deerslayer with 38" turnouts.  MAN do these attract looks.  Only had em a short time, but even non-valk riders just walk up and stare.

                           Brian's M2W with 5"X34" Howitzers                          Tim's M2W with 5"X 38" Howitzers

Click thumbs for enlargements

 

You can see how cool they look.  What does it do to the sound?  It's a little louder than the 4" stacks, and the tone is a little deeper.  I am using the same 18" glasspack inside, and solidly locating the stack and keeping the exhaust flow under control by welding on CNC-cut bulkheads on the OEM muffler can.  The stack is also welded onto the can on both ends of the rear hanger cutout.  Since the first glasspack, left side, on Deerslayer never needed replacing after 60,000 miles and 8 years (still sounded same as the right one which was replaced after the deer incident 40,000 miles later), for Deerslayer I chose to solidly weld the glasspack in the can, and remove both the inlet and outlet of the glasspack.  I had decided I wasn't going to need the Bones due to expected more volume from the larger stacks.  This allowed me to keep the length as short as possible while still supporting Silencers fully recessed (out of sight) in the turnouts.  I didn't want the turnouts extending much past the fender - to me they look better turning out alongside the tire.

I reshape the original forward cover to 5 inches on my press, which works fine and retains my paradigm of recycling parts where possible.

Fit & other issues - Because of the close proximity of the bags on Interstates and Tourers I have developed a rear hanger adapter which lowers the back end of the exhaust about a half inch.  Be sure to tell me if you need the stacks lower for IS or Tourer bag clearance.  Otherwise, the top surface is 1/2" higher and 1/2" further out than the 4" stacks.   On a Standard - or any Valk without the huge bags that hang so low to the exhaust - it bolts right up without the adapter.  I have seen a report that one of the original riders who put 5" stacks on his valk found that he needed to add another hanger "due to the weight".  I found that not to be the case in my design, as this is not the "Easy Glasspack Mod" that Lamont prototyped.  I use the original muffler can and attached mounts as a frame for the system, rather than cutting it off and discarding it.  So there is no new weak point where the stack slides over the stub of the can as per the "Easy" mod.  Weight - I weighed, using my digital scale, the stack alone at 48" length, and also a 48" Howitzer stack - same chrome maker.  This stack weighed 2-1/4 lbs more.  At 38" - the length used here - that works out to 1.8 lbs more.  Less than I expected.

BONUS - There's an inch of air behind the stack - they don't get very hot.  Your passenger WILL NOT be melting her boots on it.  And you can put your bare hands on the stacks when it's fully warmed up - great for safety (ever had to tell some lady to keep her toddler's hands off the chrome?) but you can also warm your hands directly on the stacks without burning them.

If you want Silencers or TromBones, you'll need to select Howitzers (straight cut) or Blades (miter cut), same as with the 4" stacks.

I suggest, that with the added volume of the 5" stack, Bones may not be needed - the sound is already cool without them. 

I'll make these using your choice of options:  Any length stack, Blade_tm, Howitzer_tm, or Bugle_tm , welded or clamped-in glasspacks, with or without Silencers, with or without TromBones_tm (except Bugles).  I've put the compatibility issues 2nd  paragraph below.

Obviously, the 5 inch stacks cost more - for me to buy, additional parts to make them work, and additional shop time.  Sorry that's the case, I'd rather come up with options that add business volume rather than more money per sale - but the custom look these Cannons provide - well it's worth the cost if you like it.

FIVE inch stack applications:

Minimum Stack Lengths for various options - you can always go LONGER:

All of the following use 18" glasspacks (not counting in and outlets).  All lengths directly affected if you want a different length pack.  e.g. , a 12" pack would reduce all of these by 6".  I recommend the 18" glasspack as having the best balance of volume and tone.  Frankly, really short packs are too loud for most. The Crossfire_tm option adds 2 inches to these minimum lengths.
FYI for comparison the stock cover and tip on the standard and tourer is 30 1/8".  36" stacks reach to the tip of the fender.

For all of the following, if without silencers, subtract 7" from min length:

For Blades_tm (miter) with Silencers, welded packs w/o Bones_tm.  Stack min len 32" (20+7+5)

For Blades_tm with Silencers, clamped packs w/o Bones_tm.  Stack min len 33 1/2" (1.5+20+7+5)

For Howitzers_tm (flat-cut or 90°) w/ silencers, welded packs w/o Bones_tm .  Stack min  27" (20+7)

For Howitzers_tm w/ silencers, clamped packs w/o Bones _tm.  Stack min len 28 1/2".(1.5+20+7)

For Blades_tm (miter) with Silencers, welded packs with Bones_tm.  Stack min len 34"(20+2+7+5)

For Blades_tm with Silencers, clamped packs with Bones_tm.  Stack min len 35 1/2" (1.5+20+2+7+5)

For Howitzers_tm (flat-cut or 90°) w/ silencers, welded packs with Bones_tm .  Stack min  29"(20+2+7)

For Howitzers_tm w/ silencers, clamped packs with Bones_tm.  Stack min len 30 1/2" (1.5+20+2+7)

FOUR inch stack applications:

Minimum Stack Lengths for various options - you can always go LONGER:

All of the following use 18" glasspacks (not counting in and outlets).  All lengths directly affected if you want a different length pack.  e.g. , a 12" pack would reduce all of these by 6". I recommend the 18" glasspack as having the best balance of volume and tone.  Frankly, really short packs are too loud for most. The Crossfire _tm option adds 2 inches to these minimum lengths.
FYI for comparison the stock cover and tip on the standard and tourer is 30 1/8".  36" stacks reach to the tip of the fender.

Silencers are not compatible with 4" Bugles_tm (turnout/td) stacks

For Bugles_tm (Turnouts/turndown) w/o Silencers and welded glasspacks, no Bones_tm.  Stack min. length 30"(20+10)

For Bugles_tm w/o Silencers and clamped glasspacks, no Bones_tm.  Stack min. length 31 1/2"(1.5+20+10)

For all of the following, if without silencers, subtract 7" from min length:

For Blades_tm (miter) with Silencers, welded packs w/o Bones_tm.  Stack min len 31" (20+7+4)

For Blades_tm with Silencers, clamped packs w/o Bones_tm.  Stack min len 32 1/2" (1.5+20+7+4)

For Howitzers_tm (flat-cut or 90°) w/ silencers, welded packs w/o Bones_tm .  Stack min  27" (20+7)

For Howitzers_tm w/ silencers, clamped packs w/o Bones _tm.  Stack min len 28 1/2".(1.5+20+7)

For Blades_tm (miter) with Silencers, welded packs with Bones_tm.  Stack min len 33"(20+2+7+4)

For Blades_tm with Silencers, clamped packs with Bones_tm.  Stack min len 34 1/2" (1.5+20+2+7+4)

For Howitzers_tm (flat-cut or 90°) w/ silencers, welded packs with Bones_tm .  Stack min  29"(20+2+7)

For Howitzers_tm w/ silencers, clamped packs with Bones_tm.  Stack min len 30 1/2" (1.5+20+2+7)

 

 

 

 

ORDERING DETAILS

If I'm to use your pipes, then you call me & get on the schedule, then ship them to me.     I convert your pipes and ship them back to you.  Usually takes a couple days here (depends on how many pipes are in the queue).  Include the pipes and the small cover over the end of the headers.  If you need the box and packing materials, I can send that to you for $35.   During the spring and summer seasons, the queue for glasspack mods rarely gets longer than 2 weeks.   If you want me to mod YOUR pipes, I recommend you get on the queue and keep your pipes until I say I'm almost ready for them, so your downtime is limited to shipping both ways plus a couple days here.  To get on the queue, I need to know what you're ordering, your shipping and contact info, and 50% down - which you can provide by Visa or Mastercard or by check or http://www.paypal.com
(use ValkstuffNO-SPAM@horseapple.com - remove the "NO-SPAM").
 

An alternate way to get you a Mild2W ILD_tm Trombone_tm Silencer Glasspack System is to use my core inventory for a core exchange.  This depends on availability of core pipes, which I am sourcing all the time - best to give me a call and check current availability.  These cores were previously installed on another rider's Valk, for how many miles varies, and so the quailty of these cores varies, too.  Though I don't want anything but good to excellent cores for my customers and that's what I strive to buy - I do my best to get you the best I can (see next paragraph).  Still they are used, so like a "pre-owned" car, they are as-is. If I tell you core pipes are available, send me a check (or CC#, or Paypal) for the appropriate amount in the charts below (column "incl. excl. condition cores"), I ship you completed pipes.  You install the pipes and send me your undamaged pipes back within 14 days of the ship date - see Exchange Policy time limit.  I inspect them and send you a refund of the core charge which is typically $400.

On your cores - it's important the pipes are undamaged so I can use them for the next guy.  So the standard for me to purchase your cores is, no dents, rust, pitting or obvious scratches in the chrome (visible from 6 feet), no discoloring of the chrome where it's visible when on the bike (slight discoloring under the foot pegs, under the curved chrome cover is OK), no big dents in the can or obvious damage to the stainless part of the header tubes.   I can't pay you for pipes that don't pass this inspection so please inspect them yourself first and don't send them if they have chrome damage as described - I can't fix the chrome.   It's OK if you cut off the tailpipes and poked the baffles.

What if you don't want TromBonestm?  Well the first set is discounted in a package deal with the glasspacks.  You can get just the glasspack mod for $470 + P&S.

What if you want extra TromBonestm, so you can have several different sounds?  I can do that for you, but additional Bones_tm aren't discounted because they take a lot of time to make - add $90 per extra pair you want.  If you plan to do this, it's best to do it with your pipe order so I can make them a matched set.

The chrome headers damage easily, so I recommend to keep that in mind when you remove them, and wrap the chrome pipes right away with foam blanket before handling them further.  Please be careful not to drop them on the floor when you take them off - I sometimes see a dent on the bottom.  Check out R&R and shipping tips on the R&R page.

I am making header gaskets available for $15 for the set.  It's a good idea to replace them if you want to use my pipes and replace the cores with yours - it's not necessary if we make your glasspacks out of your pipes.

Please leave the curved cover installed so I can fit the covers on final assembly.   Check out the Stacks page .

Be sure to check out the R&R Tips,  the Rider's Say, and Glasspack FAQs pages.  Any questions, I'm usually here to answer your call - but I sometimes can't hear the phone over the machines, so leave a message if I don't pick up - I check it all day long.  Toll free 1-877-338-1077.  I also check my email frequently - ValkstuffNOSPAM@horseapple.com  Thanks for your interest - I look forward to making your ride

SOUND

 AND LOOK

OUTSTANDING!

All content on www.horseapple.com copyright 1999-2006 Mark Tobias except "Riders Say", "Dyno Day", Vallejo and Shop Manual and Alternator Review pages, and SWF and MP-3 files and their graphic icons, and any content specifically attributed to another author.  
All rights reserved.  

Prices and product specifications are subject to change without notice
Orders placed via paypal.com and cancelled are subject to a 2.2% service charge
 

Glasspack mods are for off road use only.  Always wear helmet, eye and ear protection while riding.  Wear leather gloves while handling exhaust parts

¹ These pipes are built starting from the double-wall stock pipes - other pipes built from the stockers are also double wall.
² Assumes your bike is tuned per factory specs and running properly with current jetting before the install.

United States Patent #6,520,285

We have developed a CROSSOVER OPTION -  The    

and feedback indicates a HEALTHY BOOST in torque when combined with our glasspacks!  JUMP HERE to read all about it!

         So you've got a great look.  Chromed everything in sight.

 An admiring crowd surrounds your bike as you return from a shorty Rail Yard Ale.  Pullin on the goggles, you close your Vanson while fending off the usual "man, what a mill, how big is it??" 

"Geez, it must sound like a Winston Cup car."  

Developed in 2006: 

FIVE inch stacks, now including TURNOUTS
Click here...

Over 800 happy Valkyrie pipe customers since 1998

Please email me if you find any broken links.  Thanks